Saturday, September 19, 2009

OPEN THREAD: Saturday, September 19

Here is another installment of our basketball off-season weekend open thread. Here we give you the chance to ask questions, voice concerns and just leave comments. So whatever is on your mind, NC State Basketball wise, let's hear it.

Here are a few topics that can get us started:

1) With 2010 recruit Luke Cothron claiming NC State as his leader, what does this mean for the NC State staff? Remember, there is only one scholarship available right now. Cothron is a top 30 player, but so is CJ Leslie, who has been around campus quite often lately and even visiting with Coach Lowe at the Wolfpack football game. Does the staff take the first person to commit? How would you handle this situation?

2) Ryan Harrow apologizes for the way his comments may have come off in his interview with "" A testament to the way the kid has been brought up. NC State is surely getting a good one (on and off the court) in Harrow.

3.) ESPN has ranked NC State's 2010 recruiting class (Harrow/Brown) #12 in the nation. UNC is ranked #5 (Marshall/Bullock). This brings up an interesting argument. If you've seen these kids play, let us know if you really think UNC's class is 7 spots better than the Pack's.


29 Responses to "OPEN THREAD: Saturday, September 19"
  1. mike said...
    September 19, 2009 at 9:59 AM

    WPH what is your take on the 2010 UNC class? I've seen Bullock play and I think he's pretty darn good, but what about Marshall?

  2. Wolfpack Hoops said...
    September 19, 2009 at 10:15 AM

    It's a good class no doubt, but I do think that Bullock and Marshall are both a bit overrated in the rankings. Bullock is a great shooter and a high energy defender, but he has weaknesses in his game. He's not very fluid with the ball in his hands, and he isn't a great finisher around the rim (although he's pretty athletic). Think Courtney Fells with a bigger build.

    Kendall Marshall doesn't impress me, but that's just my opinion. He'll be surrounded by talent so he may look alright, but in my eyes (and I think in most people's eyes) Harrow is head over heels better than Marshall in almost every aspect. Marshall is a team leader and is very sure of himself, however he moves very stiff, and his handles are reliable but nothing special. His shot is off and on (he's a lefty), however, his vision is very good. He's a good passer and a smart basketball player, but again, I think he may be a bit overrated in the rankings.

  3. redfred said...
    September 19, 2009 at 10:40 AM

    WPH, to answer all three of your suggested topics...

    #1- That is a toughy! I guess we can hope that the coaching staff is gaining more and more insight into what either of those guys really wants to do, and which one of them will play their heart out FOR NC State. Either way, it's the type of problem we haven't had in quite some time, and it's a welcomed one to have.

    #2- No doubt!!! That comment from Harrow yesterday bowled me over. He's a very talented kid, and he could have taken those comments in any number of ways. The fact that he wanted to come forward and make a comment explaining it, and in order to clear the air, that tells me a lot about the young MAN.

    #3- What WPH??? Surely you know the answer to that already? Look no further than the current season, and the sport that they're currently highly ranked in right now. It's simply a tradition where when the folks in the sports media see powder blue, they go gah gah, their eyes glaze over, and they cannot help themselves.

    It's one of those situations where if unc bombs, the talking heads can all say, "Well, they have the athletes, Butch Davis is the coach, they just need to put it altogether. Watch out next season." Wash...spin...repeat. OTOH, if they do manage to have some success, the sports media will be all over it and saying they knew it all along.

    There is no downside in any of it for the media. Especially since football season is followed directly by BB season, and the rabid FB fans in CH can shift their focus to BB at any time their little hearts desire.

  4. Andrew said...
    September 19, 2009 at 10:44 AM

    I think that we have to take the first one who wants to commit, I am assuming that would be Cothron. I am also pretty sure that we would still recruit Leslie, and take a commitment from him if he wanted to come her, not sure how but I bet we would. We are not in a position to slow play any top 50 talent, especially a big man. On our class vs. their class. Ha ha, not only do I think we are getting two better players but the x-factor is the chemistry that those two will already have together from the moment they step on campus, they could be special. When is the last time state had a top-10 or even 5 class?

  5. Matthew said...
    September 19, 2009 at 11:07 AM

    IF they both want to come we HAVE to make that happen. Other teams make stuff like that happen all the time. Those two guys are critical to getting us over the hump.

    As far as their class being ranked 7 spots ahead of us...some people think Bullock could be the best player in the class. I think thats a bit overrated. But I think Harrow is head and shoulders better than Marshall. I'd probably rank them somewhere around where Rivals has them.

  6. Anonymous said...
    September 19, 2009 at 11:23 AM

    i think that kendall marshall is over rated and shouldn't even be a top 50 prospect

  7. Andy said...
    September 19, 2009 at 11:42 AM

    I think it will be very interesting if both Cothron and Leslie commit as to who gets the scholorship.

    WPH, I was wondering if anyone on the team is battling any health problems right now?

  8. Anonymous said...
    September 19, 2009 at 12:00 PM

    Hi WPH,

    Not sure I can interpret the Cothron sentence, but I think you take the first one that commits and then pull a Butch Davis and take the second one too!!

  9. Anonymous said...
    September 19, 2009 at 12:24 PM

    I don't think we need to worry about "which one" will get the scholarship. IMO there will be room made in some way or another. We have a few guys IMO that are walk-on talent. Not saying that is definitely what will happen but one year of free school is better than no years of free school if you follow me..

  10. Afterglow said...
    September 19, 2009 at 1:12 PM

    I think you take Cothron if he commits first. I think it’s a touchy situation that requires some foresight into the future. If the staff gets into the habit of taking someone and then recruiting another person of high caliber at that same position, you create tension and possibly turn recruits off to coming here. Let’s face it; a recruit of high caliber quality who is looking to his own future (getting into the NBA) is not want to go to a place where they aren’t going to get minutes. We are not at the Kentucky, UNC, Duke-level of recruiting-where recruits are going to want to come for the status symbol of wearing some shade of blue.

    If on the other hand, Leslie commits first and then Cothron says he’s interested in committing as well then you have a totally different situation on your hands. Both know what they are getting into and neither (I don’t believe) feels that they are being taken advantage of.

    Then there’s the other thought where you just take both and then develop one into a center; but I feel for sake of integrity, a plan like that would have to be clear to the both of them.

  11. Anonymous said...
    September 19, 2009 at 1:32 PM

    Little tidbit. We have lost at least one scholarship player from one season to the next for 14 straight years. Transfers, going pro, graduating early, medical hardship, whatever, we've had at least one scholarship open up for 14 straight years.

    Brandon Costner, Trevor Ferguson
    JJ Hickson, Marques Johnson
    Bartosz Lewandowski
    Ced Simmons, Andrew Brackman
    Adam Simons
    Dom Mejia, Mike O'Donnell
    Josh Powell, Justin Flatt
    Mike Bell
    Damien Wilkins
    Marshall Williams
    Adam Harrington, Keith Bean
    Ron Anderson, Rouldra Thomas
    Andre McCullum
    Ivan Wagner

    Absolutely no way do we stop recruiting, or turn down a commitment from either Leslie or Cothron due to scholarship limitations. And I feel fairly confident it wouldn't need to involve forcing anyone out. Attrition is normal and happens. Plenty.

  12. simonn said...
    September 19, 2009 at 2:57 PM

    NC State definitely has a better recruiting class. Harrow will come in and dominate UNC for 4 years!

  13. Anonymous said...
    September 19, 2009 at 3:22 PM

    WPH - Will Harrow and Brown sign in the early Nov period? also what are chances of Cothron or Leslie sign in November?

  14. TPack said...
    September 19, 2009 at 9:28 PM

    I think that if Cothron and Leslie both want to come, then we take them both. Odds are at least one of them will be in the NBA in a couple years anyway

  15. redfred said...
    September 19, 2009 at 10:12 PM

    WPH, why no mention of Dwight Powell? He's class of 2010, 5 star ranking PF according to Rivals, and he's still listing NC State as a possibility as well.

    That is the #4 nationally ranked PF in the class in CJ Leslie, the #7 overall in Powell, and the #8 overall in Cothron, all listing NC State as a possibility.

    I would think that's a pretty good thing to see.

  16. Sandy said...
    September 19, 2009 at 10:57 PM

    Under the circumstances, there is no way that I would turn down Cothron to wait on Leslie.

  17. redfred said...
    September 19, 2009 at 11:55 PM

    Uh Sandy, we're talking basketball here.


  18. ottoWOLFPACK said...
    September 20, 2009 at 12:08 AM

    I saw Coach Lowe at the game tonight and then walking behind him were Luke Cothron and I'm assuming Martin. I shouted out, "Luke, come to State, baby!" He seemed amused and nodded his head. I love that he has been at the past two games.

  19. Timothy said...
    September 20, 2009 at 10:16 AM

    I would love to see either Cothron or Leslie come to State. I do not know which one I would rather see come and play. The more versatiled in CJ and more power in Cothron.
    Which ever one comes we should be a tournament team and able to compete for the ACC. Also the triangle teams would not be two teams with the one in red tagging along for the fun of losing.

  20. 74Doug said...
    September 20, 2009 at 12:45 PM

    This confirms that Coach is doing it the right way. I'm not just looking ahead though, I think we'll be good this year. With just a little improvement on the perimeter that includes a healthy Degand and Thomas we'll be able to play harder on defense and more efficiently on offense. We were close last year.

  21. Anonymous said...
    September 20, 2009 at 5:40 PM

    ACC Freshman to watch.. They have Howell and Painter listed.

  22. glock said...
    September 20, 2009 at 5:43 PM

    I think there's gonna be room for both if they choose to run with us. I also feel both are 2 year maximum players, and then gone. I think the story will be told this season, with Horner graduating it will open minutes but I feel Painter is gonna be huge and it will be tough for a freshman to come in and sit him down. No one loves Luke more than me I followed him all last season even before we began recruiting him but I think he could maybe see 20-25 minutes a game as a freshman and then start his sophomore season with tracy gone. With CJ I can see him playing the 3 and possibly starting as a freshman, I love size on the wing because it's a nightmare for defenses and adds rebounds and 2nd chance points and CJ can explode off the floor. I don't think there will be a problem putting both of them on the floor together because even though both are considered PF I think Luke can play PF,C and CJ can play SF,PF. Both could be huge for us and I think we would be the best oppritunity for both to get big minutes and exposure they need to make it to the next level.It's one thing to play for big programs like UNC, but when you play against them and beat them that really turns heads. So both of you come on down along with Harrow and Brown and go down in history as the class that put N.C. STATE back to the dominating program they once were.

  23. ppack3 said...
    September 20, 2009 at 10:42 PM

    My wager is on Cothron. The Odds are stacked against us on Leslie. But, never say "never." We take both, for sure, if given the chance. All points are valid.

    Wow, Otto, thanks for the tidbit, and the promo to Luke! It is a great sign that he and Lowe are hitting it off. Luke deciding to stick around the area recently, is telling. We'll be in the mix.

    I agree that Leslie would push our program into 'elite' status! Dude can flat play! No doubt. He reminds me of KG in a lot of ways (except height). But, he gets off the floor just as well!

    Harrow, Brown, Leslie and Cothron...sick. The Idea is sick. Throw all of the other pieces together and they add up to...wait for it...HUGE!!

    Go Pack!

  24. Wolfpack Hoops said...
    September 21, 2009 at 9:06 AM

    Andy- There are a few bumps and bruises and a few guys have missed a few practices due to them, but nothing of serious note at the moment. Just run of the mill, early season type stuff.

    Anon- I think the staff is fully expecting Harrow and Brown to sign as soon as they have the opportunity. However, if they do not, it shouldn't be taken as a danger sign. Kids these days wait until the last minute a lot of the time just to keep themselves safe.

    Redfred- The staff has one 'ship open and the staff knows that as of now the best 2 options are Leslie and Cothron. Its' not too say they're closing off all other options, but their focus is on these 2.

    ...and yes Luke was at the football game this past weekend.

  25. Anonymous said...
    September 21, 2009 at 10:45 AM

    I have seen Brown and Bullock play, and can't say I was all that impressed by Bullock. Good ....sure...but just played as if he were just letting it happen. Brown seemed MUCH more of a factor in each game I saw.

  26. Jose said...
    September 21, 2009 at 10:54 AM

    Got a chance to shake hands with Coach Lowe and CJ Williams at the game. They were with getting ready to sit behind south end zone and I recognized walk on player Enrico Kuofor. There was a tall looking recruit with them- I'd say like 6' 8" to 6' 9" if I had to guess. Mystery recruit- didn't look like Luke.

    Maybe from over seas since Kuofor was with them - those German's like to speak three or four languages for what ever reason.

  27. redfred said...
    September 21, 2009 at 12:54 PM

    Thanks WPH. I just thought it odd that he is so highly ranked, he has NC State listed, and yet there has been no mention of him.

  28. Anonymous said...
    September 24, 2009 at 8:33 AM

    It is being reported by Dan Wiederer in the Fayetteville Observer that Cothron will not be playing in the ACC and likely not even in the ncaa -

    What do yall know about this?

  29. Wolfpack Hoops said...
    September 24, 2009 at 9:08 AM

    ^ We can't talk about grades b/c there are rules about privacy, however, that seems to be what this article is referring to.

    I'll just say this. The staff has checked out everything they need to check out and they are still recruiting Cothron hard. Take that for what it's worth. He'll play college ball.


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